Comments on: Scribbling in the Margins http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/ We don't need no stinking subtitle Wed, 08 Jun 2011 05:44:29 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Silver Fox http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-191 Silver Fox Sun, 15 Mar 2009 01:51:34 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-191 I've never thought of art as antisocial per se, but you have presented some good arguments for the case. When I do most forms of art that I get involved in (painting, writing), it seems like an a-social or antisocial activity because - except when trying to sell things - I am not involved with other people. But a lot of the work I do is like that. And maybe I'm not a great artist because I do it for myself first, and for others second. (Is that antisocial?!) I’ve never thought of art as antisocial per se, but you have presented some good arguments for the case. When I do most forms of art that I get involved in (painting, writing), it seems like an a-social or antisocial activity because – except when trying to sell things – I am not involved with other people. But a lot of the work I do is like that.

And maybe I’m not a great artist because I do it for myself first, and for others second. (Is that antisocial?!)

]]> By: Kelly McCullough http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-152 Kelly McCullough Mon, 09 Mar 2009 21:56:52 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-152 I'm not sure I'm entirely in agreement with you here because of this bit: <i>Art is fundamentally antisocial. That’s one thing the Methodists did get right. You can’t create art without stepping back just a little bit and seeing glimpses, here and there, of the things that societies agree to pretend don’t exist. Ironies, hypocrisies, inequalities, lies, elided truths, all of them are made manifest by the artist.</i> There is something of an underlying assumption about the purposes of art here that is one to which I'm basically allergic, that of art's purpose being to hold up a mirror to society--though I do agree that one has to step back. I'm fine with that as the purpose of some art and artists, or as one of the purposes of some art and artists, but I have real problems any time it look like <i>the</i> purpose. Now, I'm suspecting that's not what you're claiming as you tend not to let yourself get caught in simple descriptions of complex phenomena, but it's close enough to arguments I've often seen claiming that as sole purpose that I feel the need to note that there are a lot of reasons to make art, including simply making people happy or entertaining them and that those purportedly (or often so) less weighty purposes are not in my mind even the slightest bit less important. More on that <a href="http://wyrdsmiths.blogspot.com/2007/02/lie-vs-myth.html" rel="nofollow">here</a> for those who haven't heard me talk about this one before. I’m not sure I’m entirely in agreement with you here because of this bit:
Art is fundamentally antisocial. That’s one thing the Methodists did get right. You can’t create art without stepping back just a little bit and seeing glimpses, here and there, of the things that societies agree to pretend don’t exist. Ironies, hypocrisies, inequalities, lies, elided truths, all of them are made manifest by the artist.

There is something of an underlying assumption about the purposes of art here that is one to which I’m basically allergic, that of art’s purpose being to hold up a mirror to society–though I do agree that one has to step back. I’m fine with that as the purpose of some art and artists, or as one of the purposes of some art and artists, but I have real problems any time it look like the purpose. Now, I’m suspecting that’s not what you’re claiming as you tend not to let yourself get caught in simple descriptions of complex phenomena, but it’s close enough to arguments I’ve often seen claiming that as sole purpose that I feel the need to note that there are a lot of reasons to make art, including simply making people happy or entertaining them and that those purportedly (or often so) less weighty purposes are not in my mind even the slightest bit less important. More on that here for those who haven’t heard me talk about this one before.

]]> By: Greg Laden http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-146 Greg Laden Sat, 07 Mar 2009 04:07:43 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-146 How do you keep a Baptist from drinking your beer when you bring him fishing with you? Bring two Baptists. How do you keep a Baptist from drinking your beer when you bring him fishing with you?

Bring two Baptists.

]]> By: Mankel http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-145 Mankel Sat, 07 Mar 2009 03:59:42 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-145 The idea of the artist as antisocial has less than a century. To set a date and a place: Paris, 1920's. I agree the current mystic of modern art requires "breaking the social rules" but I think it just expresses the necessity to call attention and create a brand. The prize is very tempting if you are able to do that. Art also has been a way out to people that didn't fit the standards. From there came the stereotypes. The idea of the artist as antisocial has less than a century. To set a date and a place: Paris, 1920′s. I agree the current mystic of modern art requires “breaking the social rules” but I think it just expresses the necessity to call attention and create a brand. The prize is very tempting if you are able to do that.
Art also has been a way out to people that didn’t fit the standards. From there came the stereotypes.

]]> By: a daughter's mother http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-144 a daughter's mother Sat, 07 Mar 2009 03:23:55 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-144 Having grown up Methodist, and immersing myself in the church throughout my teenage years, I was always told it was the Baptists who didn't dance (or play cards or anything else we thought was fun). We did. What we Methodists weren't allowed was drinking, smoking, or other behaviors which showed we weren't being good stewards of the body we were given. Favorite joke on the subject from back when: Why don't Baptists make love standing up? Because somebody might think they were dancing! Having grown up Methodist, and immersing myself in the church throughout my teenage years, I was always told it was the Baptists who didn’t dance (or play cards or anything else we thought was fun). We did.
What we Methodists weren’t allowed was drinking, smoking, or other behaviors which showed we weren’t being good stewards of the body we were given.
Favorite joke on the subject from back when: Why don’t Baptists make love standing up? Because somebody might think they were dancing!

]]> By: Greg Laden http://quichemoraine.com/2009/03/scribbling-in-the-margins/#comment-143 Greg Laden Sat, 07 Mar 2009 02:17:12 +0000 http://quichemoraine.com/?p=379#comment-143 In the BIG picture, over the LONG term, one could argue that if the practice of art is anti-social, it is because society has moved to a different place. Throughout the world and in many cultures, things we could call art (not craft or practice or something else mundane, but the skilled transformative performance or expression, as "art" as any modern Western art) is in many cases among the most social activity one can find. In the BIG picture, over the LONG term, one could argue that if the practice of art is anti-social, it is because society has moved to a different place. Throughout the world and in many cultures, things we could call art (not craft or practice or something else mundane, but the skilled transformative performance or expression, as “art” as any modern Western art) is in many cases among the most social activity one can find.

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